Polygamy: What Love Is This?  
RESPONSES TO COMMON QUESTIONS & CHALLENGES

We welcome honest, seeking questions, but we try to avoid repeatedly dealing with questions that come on the air with no other purpose than to harrass or antagonize. HOWEVER, we absolutely do NOT want to discourage ANY question, no matter how "contentious" it might seem to be, which is why we have created this page, to answer some of the common "challenge" questions that we get on the TV show.

We are more than happy to discuss these questions in more depth on an individual basis, if these questions come from a sincere desire to discover truth.

If your question is not answered here, not answered to your satisfaction, or if you wish to discuss something in more depth, please contact us. But please know that while we love to discuss these matters with honest seekers, we will not devote much time to communications that are meant to be antagonistic or contentious.

1 Why do you 'bash' Mormons?
2 Just talk about what you believe instead of tearing down someone else's faith!
3 Your show is about polygamy. Mormons don't practice polygamy!
4 Polygamy was taught and promoted in the Bible!
5 You hypocrite. What makes the Bible any more "right" than the Book of Mormon?
6 Do you believe all Mormons are going to hell?
7 What about all the people who never get to hear about Jesus? Do you believe they go to hell?
8 The Trinity makes no sense; if Jesus and God are one, then who was he praying to all those times?
9 Traditional Christianity and its creeds all come from Constantine and the Council of Nicea.
10 The Bible is just a bunch writings put together by Roman political leaders, and yet you say that nothing can be added to it.
11 You believe in salvation by grace alone. So you're saying you can pray a little prayer and then live any way you please?
12 What about all those different "Christian" churches out there. How can you know which one is the right one?

 



1.  Why do you "bash" Mormons?

 

First and foremost, we are not attacking or bashing Mormons, or anyone else.  That would mean that we were telling lies, and doing so in a mean-spirited way, and this is not at all what we are doing! We often get accused of being hateful, but nothing could be further from the truth.

We are challenging truth claims of Mormonism; we are NOT in any way against the Mormon people. Quite the opposite!  Our motivation in bringing forth these challenges is out of concern for those who believe and live under false teachings. 

We recognize that many Mormons are conditioned to interpret any sort of challenge to their faith claims as an "attack."  But the fact of the matter is, this is simply a wrong (and uncharitable) interpretation of our motives. 

We invite anyone to judge us based on the facts and information we provide.  If we are in error, or even say anything that is misleading, please make your case, and if we are proven to be in error, we will happily make the correction!  Our objective is to support and promote the truth, and point people to the truth of Jesus!

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2.  Just talk about what you believe instead of tearing down someone else’s faith!

 

If you watch the show long enough, you will find that we clearly and repeatedly speak about biblical truth, which is what we base our faith upon.  But one of the objectives of our show is to communicate the truth that God does not command or encourage polygamy, and by extension, He does not institute all the rigors of the Mormon lifestyle.  Our goal is to preach freedom in Jesus Christ, and to speak of truth often requires pointing out falsehoods.

But having said that, we refer you back to answer No. 1, in that we are not trying to tear down anyone’s faith; rather, we want to build up faith in the true Jesus Christ.

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3. Your show is about polygamy. Mormons don't practice polygamy!

 

First of all, we have NEVER suggested that modern-day Mormonism promotes the practice of polygamy, at least not in the here and now. In fact, we have often taken great pains to make this very clear that they don't.

If anything, we challenge the modern-day Mormon church for not living up to their existing doctrine, which clearly states that polygamy must be practiced in the here and now, in order for exaltation to be achieved.

Polygamy is still embedded in current Mormon doctrine. Section 132 of the Doctrine & Covenants (despite attempts to downplay it) is clearly talking about the necessity of polygamy for exaltation. Not only that, but polygamy was practiced, taught, and promoted by Joseph Smith, Brigham Young, and many of the early Mormon presidents. It was taught as an everlasting covenant. It was taught as a requirement for eternal life. It was taught as a fundamental principle of Mormonism. These are undeniable, historical facts. Now, mormonism may not promote polygamy as a practice today, but it is still considered to be an important aspect of the afterlife.

So Mormonism is being deceptive, both to the outside world, and their own membership, by pretending that there is no connection between Mormonism and polygamy.  You may hear excuses that it was only practiced by a few select people, or that it was done to help take care of needy widows or single women. This is simply not historically true. Polygamy began as a revelation by Joseph Smith, and was sustained as an eternal and everlasting doctrine and commandment of God by many subsequent LDS prophets, all of whom are revered in mainstream Mormonism. 

Many Mormons are extremely sensitive about being discussed in the same breath as the polygamists or the fundamentalists.  And yet it is downright dishonest (or at least very ill-informed) to state that the two have nothing in common.  The doctrines of Mormonism and the doctrines of the fundamentalist groups are nearly identical; they differ only in some of their practices.  Now, there may be individuals within mainstream Mormons who disagree with some of these doctrines, and in some cases, may never even have heard of them, but the fact remains that they are still a part of the fabric of even the mainstream LDS Church, though are often de-emphasized.

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4.  Polygamy was taught and promoted in the Bible!

 

First of all, polygamy was never promoted, condoned, or commanded in the Bible. Polygamy is recorded in the Bible as a historical fact. So was murder, rape, and theft.

A number of the “heroes” of the Old Testament had more than one wife.  But then again, a number of the “heroes” of the Old Testament also lied, cheated, stole, murdered, and a host of other ungodly activities.  Does this mean that God commanded, or even condoned that sinful behavior too?  Of course not.

You will find no where in the Bible where God commands polygamy or has anything positive to say about it.  We challenge viewers to find an instance where God commands it, much less makes it a requirement for salvation.

Yes, some of His servants practiced it, but they did so to their own detriment.  The most famous cases of Abraham, Jacob, David, and Solomon give many clear examples of how polygamy was a curse and an ungodly burden, and not a blessing.  (It is often assumed that Moses and Isaac and other prophets like Isaiah practiced polygamy, but there is absolutely no biblical support for this.)

In biblical times, polygamy was (and it still is) a source of strife, friction, jealousy, and a host of other ungodly outcomes. In many passages throughout the Old and New Testaments, God expresses a very dim view of polygamy, and upholds the ideal of a marriage between one man, and one woman. 

So the question is, why would God make even allowances for polygamy? Why would he bless men like Abraham, Jacob, David, and Solomon, if polygamy were so wrong?  Well, the same reason he blessed them despite other sins in their lives (and they all were sinners)—because God is a loving, merciful God who loved them, and because they had placed their faith in Him, and not in their own righteousness.  The same reason that we receive blessings, in spite of the fact that each of us are sinners.  This does not mean that God takes a soft stand on sin; quite the contrary.  But it does mean that in His mercy, he tolerates our sin--for a time--to give us the opportunity to repent and place our faith in Him.

(A more thorough treatment of this subject can be found in Doris Hanson's booklet, Is Polygamy Biblical? and is available free of charge to seeking Mormons or Mormon Fundamentalists. For more information on receiving a copy, click here.)

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5. You hypocrite. What makes the Bible any more "right" than the Book of Mormon?

 

Our reasons for disbelieving in Mormonism are based on indisputable, historical fact, and not simply because it disagrees with biblical Christianity. We challenge Mormonism because Joseph Smith does not meet the standard for a prophet--that is, that his prophecies come true. The ample historical evidence concerning the life of Joseph Smith clearly paints a picture of someone who was not speaking for God.

We challenge Mormonism because the keystone of Mormonism, the Book of Mormon, has no historical substantiation whatsoever. Geography, language, history, genetics, anthropology, archaeology, all of these disciplines have found no shred of conclusive evidence supporting the Book of Mormon. (For more information on this topic, we invite you to watch the online video of The Bible vs. The Book of Mormon.) To dismiss these serious problems and say "it's a matter of faith" is not a sign of strong faith. It is a sign of misplaced faith. A strong conviction of faith and belief, no matter how strong or sincere, does not make something true. If the Book of Mormon is not true, then Mormonism can't be true.

Now, on the flip-side, the Bible is based on historical, verifiable fact. While there are many secular humanist detractors of the Bible, a thorough and honest examination of many of the detractors' claims actually reveal many of the same logical problems as those who promote the Mormon scriptures.

The Bible, which is the "keystone" of biblical Christianity, has an enormous amount of historical substantiation, including its fulfilled prophecies; verifiable geographical features, cities, historical events, historical figures, and so forth. Much of the Bible's historical claims is substantiated from other sources outside the Bible. The Book of Mormon, for example, can't say this.

Are we Christians simply because the Bible has a strong historical foundation? No...but we need to ask: would it be possible to be a believing Christian if the Bible were not believable? Absolutely not! If the Bible didn't have a historical foundation, if it were shown to be false, how could we believe what it says? Even the apostle Paul says that if, for example, the resurrection of Jesus is but a myth, then our faith is in vain. So historical reality DOES matter. It IS important.

So the historical reality of the Bible (and the historical falsehood of the Book of Mormon) are very real, very compelling, and very relevant issues when it comes to matters of faith. Faith needs to be placed in something real, not something imaginary. And truth, if it be true, should fear no investigation.

However, we are Christians not just because we have a historical foundation, but because of the living, life-changing faith we have in Jesus Christ, who has freed us from our sins and who has given us eternal life.

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6. Do you believe all Mormons are going to hell?

 

First of all, it is not within our power nor our right to make a statement about the eternal destiny of any one individual, let alone an entire group of people!

We don't want ANYONE to go to hell, and that is one of our biggest motivations for proclaiming biblical truth. What we proclaim is simply what God has proclaimed in the Bible--that salvation from hell, and salvation to eternal life comes only through Jesus Christ, and placing our lives and our faith in Him. And that rejecting Him is to reject the salvation that He offers. And sadly, many are going to do this.

Jesus says that many people are on the "wide path" that will lead to their destruction. But at judgment, which we all will face, it is Jesus alone who possesses the power to judge rightly--execute judgment, and He will make that call for each person. So we will not presume to make that judgment for Him.

All we want to do is declare the way He has shown to be saved. We simply want to point people to the sure way to eternal life, through faith in Him, and not through the dead works of religion.

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7. What about all the people that never get a chance to hear about Jesus? Do you believe they go to hell?

 

In Romans, Paul says that even Creation speaks of God's existence, so no one will be without excuse. No one will be able to stand before Jesus and say "I didn't know!" God is perfectly capable of making right, true, and merciful judgments, according to each person's faith. He is also capable of revealing Himself to all people, and the Bible says that He does. Jesus is God, the Creator, and he reveals himself to all, even those who may not have had the benefit of reading a Bible or hearing a sermon. So the criteria will be the same for all--do they accept and put their faith in God, or do they reject Him?

Usually the "subtext" of this question (when it comes from Mormons, anyway) is, how can we assure the salvation of people who don't get to go through all the religious ordinances in this life? The Mormon practice of baptisms by proxy for the dead are said to provide an opportunity to those who have died before, to embrace the Mormon "gospel."

Our response to this is: what about the millions, and probably billions of people that, because of sheer numbers, and the obscurity of history, and isolation of remote tribes and civilizations, are unknown to Mormons, and therefore will never have the opportunity to be baptized by proxy? Are they doomed to languish in hell, and have no hope for eternal life or exaltation, simply because their names are not recorded in a database in downtown Salt Lake City?

Biblical faith answers this question quite easily--God is the judge, and God judges rightly. If God must rely upon a host of ordinances and works and rites and rituals performed on earth in order to secure the salvation or eternal life of anyone, as is the case in Mormonism, that makes him out to be considerably less than the eternal, all-powerful, all-knowing loving God of the Bible.

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8. The Trinity makes no sense; if Jesus and God are one, then who was he praying to all those times?

 

The doctrine of the Trinity is nothing more and nothing less than the reconciliation of four straightforward, undeniable statements which are found liberally scattered throughout the Bible, both Old and New Testament, and they are:

1. There is only ONE God.
2. The Father is God.
3. Jesus is God.
4. The Holy Spirit (or Holy Ghost) is God.

Period. The reason this is such a hard concept for many Mormons to grasp is because of the belief that God the Father is a man with flesh and bones, and so the idea that Jesus and the Father are one being is nonsensical to them. But if you understand that God is spirit...and not only spirit but that He is eternal, all-powerful, and ever-present, then the Trinity is not such an impossible concept to grasp, because it is certainly within the ability of an all-powerful God to manifest himself however he pleases, including the miracle of incarnation, Jesus coming to humanity in the flesh, as a human.

Is the Trinity a mystery? Absolutely. God Himself is a mystery, and it would be arrogant to presume that we, with our finite minds, could fully grasp an infinite God. But the Trinity is the way in which God has chosen to reveal Himself to mankind.

As for who Jesus was praying to when he prayed to the Father, he was doing just as the Bible said; he was praying to the Father. This is not a problem with a biblical understanding of the Trinity. God inhabited a fully human body in Jesus in order to draw people to himself. His love, his humility, his servitude, and yes, his submission to the Father, was Jesus teaching by example.

For an expanded article on the Trinity, please click here.

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9. Traditional Christianity all comes from Constantine and the Council of Nicea.

 

The council of Nicea is perhaps one of the most misunderstood, and most maligned, components of Church history among Mormons. So it's important to set some things straight.

First, the Council of Nicea does not form the basis of traditional Christianity; Jesus Christ, his nature and his atoning work on the cross are what form the basis of Christianity. The Council of Nicea at best can be said to affirm this understanding, and not create it.

Some facts: The council was indeed called for by Constantine in AD 325. The purpose of this council was to address controversies surrounding unbiblical heresies that were creeping into a few (but by no means all) of the Christian churches. These teachings were being propagated by a church leader named Arius, and what he was teaching was that Jesus was less than God, and a created being.

Constantine's agenda or intention for the Council may continue to be debated, but the end result of the Council is not. The church leaders gathered and examined the gospels and the teachings of the apostles in order to arrive at an understanding of the nature and purpose of Jesus Christ; and they concluded, based on those teachings, that he is wholly and completely God, that he was not a lesser being, nor was he created. (This teaching is entirely consistent the New Testament.) The discussion gave rise to the doctrine of the Trinity, which is simply an affirmation of the teachings and concepts that had already been well-established in the Bible. It was not a "new" idea in the least; it was simply affirmed in concise terms in a way that hadn't been done before.

As for the biblical canon, there is no historical basis to suggest that the biblical canon was established or even discussed at the Council of Nicea. (See next question on the biblical canon.) Thus the establishing of the biblical canon cannot be attributed to this council or to Constantine's pressure.

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10. The Bible is just a collection of writings put together by Roman political leaders, and yet you say that nothing can be added to it.

 

Contrary to popular belief among Mormons, the Council of Nicea had nothing to do with the assembly of the canon of scripture. By the time the Council of Nicea was called, this canon was already fairly well established.

There wasn't any one singular event or action that caused the canon to be formed. The New Testament as we know it today was comprised of the four gospels and the writings of the early apostles and eyewitnesses to Jesus himself, and they were used very commonly among the early church, even before there was any concept of what a "canon" would be.

So by the time the canon was well-established, generally thought to be in the late AD 200s, it was little more than an acknowledgment, an affirmation, and an ordering of the books and writings that were already being used as authoritative teachings. The books that ended up being rejected by the churches (including the so-called "gnostic gospels") were rejected by the churches not because of some political conspiracy, but because they were not written by contemporaries of Jesus Christ, and more importantly, because they contradicted the teachings of Jesus and the apostles who learned directly from Jesus.

As for the idea of a "closed canon" (the idea that nothing should be added to the Bible), Mormons are quick to point out that the verse at the end of Revelation that states that nothing should be added to "this book" refers only to the book of Revelation, and not the whole Bible. And this much is true. In fact, there are similar warnings in the first five books of the Old Testament. So obviously these verses are NOT what justify a closed canon.

So why is the Bible considered a "closed canon"? This is not so much a doctrinal question as it is a practical one. The Bible's purpose was to show God's interaction with humanity and how we can be saved. That was completely and fully accomplished in Jesus Christ, who is the final revelation to end all revelations. To suggest that more scriptures are needed is to say that Jesus is not enough for our salvation. The Bible does not require any kind of "updating" for modern times. It addresses the same basic problem--our sin; and the same wonderful solution--Jesus Christ.

Our objection to the Mormon writings isn't that they are considered new "scripture," it's that they do not conform to what God has revealed. The Book of Mormon, for example, is historically inaccurate, and thereby cannot be God's Word because God is a God of truth. The other Mormon writings and teachings go contrary to what God had already revealed in the Bible, and therefore cannot be true, because God does not change and go back on his word.

This does not mean that God doesn't continue to speak to His people today. God is faithful to speak to, lead, guide, and yes, even reveal things through His Spirit to all who believe in Him, even today. But he has given us the Bible as the measuring stick, the standard of doctrine, and His unchanging Truth, to which all things must be compared, and to which all teachings must conform.

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11. You believe in salvation by grace alone. So you're saying you can pray a little prayer and then live any way you please?

 

Absolutely NOT. You will never find this teaching in the Bible. In fact, this is perhaps one of the most pervasive mistruths that are propagated among Mormons about biblical Christianity.

As followers of Jesus, we are called to live holy lives, pleasing to Him, following His example. We are called to good works. It is expected.

HOWEVER, the biblical teaching of salvation by grace alone means that it is NOT our good works or our attemps at holiness that saves us. It is the work of Jesus Christ, and his holiness that saves us.

Somebody who is truly saved has entered into a loving relationship with Jesus, and desires to please him. And that relationship with Jesus Christ changes us, from the inside. He is the one who works in us, on a daily basis, to start ridding our lives of sin, and undoing our appetite for sin. He is the one who instills in us a desire--and the ability--to do truly good works that please and glorify Him.

Christians, like everyone else on the planet, will still sin. They are still imperfect. But if their faith is true, they are also being changed--not by their own efforts and will power, but by the power of Jesus Christ in their lives. In fact, if there is no evidence of true regeneration, if there is no outpouring of the works that God requires, if a person's attitude is truly "I don't care what God thinks, I'm going to live as I please," then that is not biblical faith. That is not saving faith. That is the dead faith that is referred to in James chapter 2.

But make no mistake: salvation comes through faith alone in Jesus Christ, and it is that salvation that enables us to do good works and live holy lives. It is NOT our ability to do good works or live holy lives that enables us to be saved.

If you're frustrated in your attempts to be as righteous as you know you ought to be, this is because you can't do it. Sure, maybe you can do things to look good to those around you, and fool others (and perhaps even fool yourself) into believing that you're righteous, but it's Jesus alone that knows our hearts, which is where the real root problem is. And he alone can solve that problem. And the good news is--he will, if you'll let him!

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12. What about all those different "Christian" churches out there. How can you know which one is the right one?

This represents another of the common mistruths that are propagated among Mormons about biblical Christianity--the belief that all the varying churches and denominations that call themselves Christians all disagree and don't get along, and all have different doctrines and different interpretations of the Bible. This simply isn't true.

Are there differences? Of course. Churches differ in personality and practices, they differ in organizational structure, they differ in worship styles. They even differ on emphasizing some things, and on secondary issues.

But churches that are truly biblically-based are united in the key doctrines of salvation, and can call one another "brothers and sisters in Christ," because they are united in those key doctrines of eternal life. In fact, any church organization that claims to be the one and only true church by definition CANNOT be, because it disregards what the Bible says about what makes a church "true."

Yes, there is "One True Church" and it's called the Body of Christ. But it is not an earthly organization. It is the collection of all people, from anywhere in the world, and from any church or denomination (or perhaps from no church organization at all), that have placed his or her life and faith in Jesus Christ alone, and trusts in Him alone for their eternal salvation. That is the biblical definition of the true Church. This church is not seen, directed, proscribed, or defined by any man or any organization. There is no earthly corporation that oversees it. There is no exclusive prophet or mouthpiece of God, except God himself in Jesus Christ, and His revelation through His Word. Jesus is the head of the church, and He alone can rightly judge, and fully recognize all who belong to Him.

Becoming part of this unseen Church does not require laws and rites and ordinances or certifications or interviews or membership records. It requires nothing more than placing your life in Jesus' hands, placing your faith in His righteousness, and trusting in Him alone for eternal life.

If you have done that, then you can be assured that you belong to His church. If you haven't done it, we encourage you to do that right now! (Please contact us if you want to discuss this further.)

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©2010 by A Shield and Refuge Ministry
(A Ministry of Main Street Church)



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